Embrace the Outlier Mindset to break free from the daily grind and live a life you love! This episode is for you! Penny Zenker chats with entrepreneur Rodman Schley about his unconventional approach to business, real estate, and life. You’ll learn about the seven tenets of the Outlier Mindset, including the powerful concept of “Sacred Boxes” to identify what truly matters to you. Rodman also shares how to avoid the trap of perfectionism and embrace continuous learning to fuel exponential growth. Whether you’re an entrepreneur or simply seeking a more fulfilling life, this episode will inspire you to hit the reset button and live your life by design!

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Escape The Grind: The Outlier Mindset For Entrepreneurs With Rodman Schley

We are talking about all things mindset and entrepreneur. If you put those together, it’s also a very different way and dynamic way of thinking. That’s what we’re going to be talking about. Rodman Schley is here with us. He calls himself, “The Schley guy.” He’s a renowned serial entrepreneur. He’s a real estate expert and acclaimed television producer and host, a published author, an executive consultant, an entrepreneur coach, and a captivating keynote speaker. His unconventional approach to entrepreneurship, business, real estate investment, and leadership has garnered acclaim from entrepreneurs, investors, and business leaders worldwide. We’re going to pick his brain to see what is his secret. Welcome to the show, Rodman.

I’m so glad to be here. Let’s take the secret and let’s get it out in the world.

It’s my favorite thing, unconventional approach. Tell me more about that.

Unconventional Approach

If you think about how most people are living life, you have this big bell curve in life. You have most people who are living inside of this bell curve. They’re getting up every day. They’re doing the same things. Maybe it’s something they don’t even want to be doing. They’re getting up in the morning. They’re hitting that alarm clock. They’re eating breakfast. They’re going to work. They’re spending eight to ten hours a day doing stuff they don’t want to be doing to come home, have some dinner, spend some time with family, go to bed, and get up and do it over and over again.

Sounds like Groundhog’s Day.

It’s driving them crazy. It’s most people, most days. Why do we live that way? Life is short. We have such a limited time on this planet. Why are we spending it doing all the stuff that we don’t want to be doing? When we’re talking about unconventional, it’s how do you break out of the middle of that bell curve and get out on the peripheries? How do you become an outlier?

That’s the name of your book that was released, The Outlier Mindset.

Yes. The Outlier Mindset. It’s about thinking differently and accepting being different. Many people get out in life and they are trained from an early age to be like everybody else. When you go to school, you need to dress a certain way, you need to sit in a certain way, you need to not talk in class, you need to obey the adult, and you need to do all of these things in life. You go to college. You have parents and other people say, “You need to be a doctor, you need to be a lawyer.”

We have all these people telling us how we should be in life. We wonder why many people get stuck doing things they don’t want to be doing. For me, The Outlier Mindset is how can we help people get their life in a place where they want to be doing the things that they love to be doing. How can we get them into a different mindset to start to get out of that bell curve, to get out of that mundane part of life that’s over and over again, and start to align your purpose with how you’re living?

Outliers

Let me ask you this because I’m all about that. I like to put on the hat of people listening. I’m an entrepreneur. You’re an entrepreneur. It seems easier for us than some people because they’re in a job. They feel like, “I have a day job. What’s wrong with that? I don’t have an entrepreneurial mindset. I don’t want to have that level of responsibility. I like the security.” Are we talking about that you have to have your own business or are we talking about a way of thinking about how we approach our life?

A way to approach your life. You don’t have to be an entrepreneur to be an outlier. Let’s say my goal and my purpose in life is to cure cancer. I’m probably not going to get up tomorrow, put a shingle out there, and say, “I got a new business trying to cure cancer.” I’m probably going to align myself with a group.

Maybe some a lab that’s got good money coming in, that I can do research and that I can do the things that I want to be doing. It doesn’t necessarily mean you have to be an entrepreneur to be doing exactly what you want to be doing. Your life by design could come in a setting where you are empowered to align with who you are on the inside with what’s showing up on the outside.

What they could look like for someone who is whatever they do for their day. Let’s use that cancer example, that they’re passionate about supporting people who have cancer and looking for a cure for cancer. That they’re going to get involved, that they’re going to surround themselves with people that think the same, that have the same desires and the same goals. That’s what I hear you saying.

For sure. Your tribe is important as one of the tenets of an outlier. You want to make sure that you are getting in rooms with people who don’t necessarily have to think like you do because you don’t want everybody to think like you do. That’s how you open up your capacity and learn by getting in roomfuls of people who know different things, but at least a group of people who can take what you’re doing and be lifting you, and supporting you on your mission and be saying, ”That’s a great purpose.”

 

Maybe they have a similar purpose or the same purpose. Getting in a room with those types of people, the people that are struggling, the ones that are sitting in the middle because you can be an outlier wherever you’re at in life, but you can’t where it’s tough to be an outlier is if you’re doing something that wasn’t meant for you.

If you’re that person going to that 9:00 to 5:00 job and it’s not something that lights you up, you’re going through these routines or going through these motions day in and day out, you’re not going to ever be exceptional there doing the things that you don’t love. If you’re going to be exceptional, if you’re going to be an outlier, if you’re going to build that life by design around your purpose, then you need to make sure that you’re doing what you love.

Sacred Boxes

How do I do that? I think it’s easy for people to say but a little bit harder to do and to even visualize that. How do I know what I love and how do I then design my life around that?

People get stuck because of a lot of things. Maybe they have a family to support. Maybe they have a house mortgage payment. Maybe they have car payments. Whatever it might be, it’s like, “I got to go to this job I can pay for this. I have to support that. I got this family.” What happens is we start building a life around something that wasn’t meant for us and then all of a sudden, we have obligations that we have to take care of and it’s hard to unweave the web.

I always tell people the first thing you have to do, the first place that you have to start is you got to sit down with yourself and you have to have that moment where you identify what is important to you, what matters to you. For me, I have what they call the sacred checkbox. When I sat down, I said, “What am I good at? What do I love? What do I like my days to look like? When I get up in the morning, what do I want my time to look like when I’m spending that 8 to 10 hours working?”

What do I want my life to look like in that period? Once I decided these are the things that are important to me, I came up with four checkboxes. For me, I’m a real estate investor. I love to invest in real estate. That was one of my checkboxes. I love to teach. I love to inspire, and then I love to travel. As an entrepreneur, we have a hard time saying no to things.

Some people have the spirit where it’s if they see a good thing, they’ll put profit before passion. I was that guy for a while. That’s why the sacred checkboxes were important because once I identified what was important to me, it became much easier to say no to everything else. If it didn’t check those boxes, it was a hard no.

Somebody could have said, “We’re going to make $10 million on this deal,” and it was still a hard pass because it didn’t align with who I was. What did I do when I had those checkboxes? Number one, I love to write books. I started writing books to take what I knew to teach. Hopefully, I inspire people to get out of that curve and to get over into that outlier zone.

As a real estate investor who loves to travel, I started a business. I have a private equity fund that invests in short-term vacation rentals all over the world. I get a chance to invest and travel while I’m still teaching and inspiring. All my boxes get checked every single day but how do you break out of that pattern? How do you get there? You have to start by identifying what’s important to you.

I tell people, “You don’t have to run into anything,” because many people say, “Do you know what? You’re right. I’m not aligned with the way I want to be living. I’m going to quit my job today. I’m going to do this tomorrow.” The problem is a lot of times they don’t have their money right. I always tell people, that the first thing we have to do is to get our mindset right.

With the mindset, that’s the first thing that we were talking about. It’s identifying what’s important to us but then if you look at getting your money right, many people will go and quit that job. They’ll get into it and find out they can’t support themselves in the first month, the first two months, or the first three months, and then they say, “I failed.”

They didn’t necessarily fail. They weren’t prepared enough financially to go the distance it took to succeed. I tell people to start with the side hustle. Don’t quit that job tomorrow but if you want to be an entrepreneur or you want to start going that route, start a side hustle and make that side hustle make you quit that job.

I like those sacred boxes. That’s an actionable thing that everybody can do right now. It’s to identify their four sacred boxes. What I like about what you described is you talked about teaching, inspiring, and traveling. Those are all things that can be accomplished in several different ways. We also have to remember that there are a lot of different ways to fulfill our needs. I love that. You gave us an actionable thing to do. I also wanted to ask you though, how do these sacred boxes differ from values? Are they the same or different, and how do they differ?

Your values can come into play when you’re developing your sacred boxes. When I’m sitting down with myself and determining what’s important to me. What are my values? Now when we talk about maybe life values or their spiritual values. Many different things encompass values. What are my values so that when I get up, I’m not sacrificing or I’m not going in and saying, “I’m going to sacrifice this value to get that.”

I want to always get my boxes to align with what’s important to me and my values. Once I can start to align those things, that I think is golden. It’s a part of the process where you’re sitting down and when you’re trying to figure out what’s important to you, consider your values. I know so many people who may have spiritual values. They bring their spiritual values into everything that they do in their work too and how they show up in life. You can show up in whatever your sacred checkboxes are. You can show up in your values also. Your values are going to be integrated into those boxes.

Thanks for that clarification. In my language, this would be a reset moment. This is a moment when you realize that you’re not fulfilled. Life isn’t having the meaning that you expected it to have. By recognizing it and calling it a reset moment, you’re giving yourself the space to step back and take a look at your values and the sacred boxes, getting some perspective on a plan of how you’re going to go about implementing that and then realigning your day-to-day so that it can work that way.

The Outlier Mindset

I love how you said, “Have a plan for the money.” Don’t think that you’re going to drop everything. You have to think about it. You have to plan it out a little bit for that. Tell us what else in this Outlier Mindset. I don’t know how many steps there are, but what I understood so far is to get the mindset right and get the money right. I would imagine maybe there’s one or two others.

In terms of the pathway, if you’re looking to get to the other side, there are seven tenets of an outlier, and there are also four pillars of what you should be looking to do when you’re making. I love that reset. I love the idea of the reset. I think that’s perfect because you have to get to reset. If you’re not resetting up here, if you’re not starting with the mindset and getting that reset, as you said, many people are so entrenched in what they’re doing that they don’t even understand that they’re stuck. It is critical to hit that reset button and to start to work on it up here and get going in a different direction than you’re going. The only way you can do that is with the hard reset. It’s like when your computer is frozen, you have to hit the reset button.

So many people are so entrenched in what they're doing that they don't even understand that they're stuck. Share on X

There’s the hard reset that you are talking about, but then there’s also the ongoing resets. I call these reset moments like a feedback loop that we’re constantly checking in on our path. Maybe your four sacred boxes and as you start to live them, you want to replace one of them and think, “It’s not this, it’s this.”

It’s about being more dynamic in the way that we also approach what we want and what’s meaningful to us because we’re learning as we go. Instead of waiting until the end and evaluating something, we want to constantly check in, but we’re too busy to think and take this time. Making the time for these critical reset points and reset moments is important.

While we’re talking about that, I’d like to go into some of these other tenets and pillars. Since we’re talking about that, the book that I have coming up is called The Reset Mindset. How would you define based on your Outlier Mindset? I know that you don’t know anything about the book, but how would you define what a reset mindset means to you based on your world?

In my world, I would think about taking that time. As I said, many people are on cruise control in life and there are a lot of reasons why that happens. All of them are valid reasons. There are very valid reasons why people get into a groove, a trend, or get into a way they’re doing things day in and day out.

You never want to invalidate what’s the why behind that but the true reset comes when they take the step out of it, take the step back, and get that self-awareness. To me, it’s when do you get that self-awareness of where you’re at. It’s hard. When you’re in it every single day or when you’re seeing it every single day, sometimes you can’t even identify that it’s there because it’s entrenched in who you are and what you’re doing.

The true reset comes when you take the step back and get that self-awareness. Share on X

That first reset moment becomes that piece of self-awareness where you sit down with yourself. Sometimes maybe it’s because you’re miserable, you can’t do it anymore or maybe you had a life-altering event. I spoke with a gentleman who I love and does a great job at what he does. He’s an incredible human being, but he was telling me that he’s stuck.

He said, “I am stuck. I am doing many great things, but I’m not doing what I want to be doing.” For him, that was his reset moment. The fact that he saw that and he identified it within him, that’s how you can move forward but if you can’t identify what’s wrong inside of you, how are you going to fix what’s going on both inside of you and outside of you?

I was thinking before you had said that about your friend. What gets you stuck?

I would say that I’m a perfectionist. For me, sometimes 80% is good enough. Most people can’t do that. If you’re a perfectionist, some people maybe can, and may be easy for them. Maybe it’s hard for me but for me, I’m such a perfectionist that I want things to be good for everybody around me. Everything I put into the world, every bit of content I put out, it’s like I’m overly critical of the stuff that I’m putting out that I’m ripping people off because I’m not getting the content out to them fast enough. I’m not getting information out to them fast enough.

Sometimes you have to sit back and say, “Do you know what? Get out of that. Get unstuck with that and get moving on.” The other thing is, that I’ve always been about evolving exponentially. How can we personally and professionally evolve at a rate that’s higher than normal life? It comes through learning. It comes through dropping your ego down. It comes through getting in there and saying, “Do you know what? I don’t know everything.” In the grand scheme of life, we know nothing.

The more we know, the less we know. That’s the way I feel. The more I know, I feel the less I know.

That’s a great place to be because you’re always looking to learn, but you can also get stuck. If you feel like you don’t know enough or you’re having the imposter syndrome or, “I am not good enough. I am not this.” That’s crap. People need to get up and they need to realize that everybody is in the same boat, except for my 22-year-old nephew who told me that he knows everything and that’s fine.

My 20-year-old son is the same.

At some point in time, they will both get up one morning and realize that they know nothing too. Their life will evolve exponentially because they’ve accepted that and they’re okay with it.

Evolve Exponentially

I like that. I’m all about the exponential as well, like exponential learning or exponential growth, looking for where I can find leverage, and I enjoy the game of it. I play it a little bit as a game as to how can we find a better way that’s going to create a multiplier. That helps it from being too stressful.

My new book is coming out, the game is, “How do I reach the New York Times bestseller list?” I’m setting a big goal so that I look for those leverage points. Sometimes it works well and sometimes it falls short but always it’s challenging and playing it as a game. How do you approach that? I know as a perfectionist, that must be hard.

Yes, but it’s one of those things where I’ve let my ego down. When you’re trying to evolve exponentially, I always tell people as part of it was one of the tenets of an outlier, “Being willing to understand that you’re always going to be seeking knowledge, that you’re always going to be growing, and that you’re always going to be trying to be better. You’re always going to be evolving.”

I was talking to the same gentleman and I was telling him that where I am right now is very different from where I was six months ago. Why? It is because you’re evolving. That’s a great thing. Some people think that you’re wishy-washy or maybe if you’re not this steady throughout your life, I don’t know if you’re wishy-washy.

For me, it’s always been about know. I love people who are always identifying that they are growing, that they’re evolving, that they’re learning, and that they’re getting better. As a perfectionist, it’s frustrating at times when I want to know everything right now. I want to be the best I can be right now. I want all that knowledge that I can get right now. You have to take a step back from that and say, “It’s okay.”

It’s okay to take your time. It’s okay to learn. Tomorrow, you’re going to know more than you did today. You’re going to look back at some things you did six months ago. You’re going to say, “I wish I would have done it differently.” That’s okay. At least you tried. At least you did. If you didn’t do anything six months ago, you’d be sitting there saying, “I wish I would have tried.” You would have what I’m always trying to solve for people, and that’s regret.

You don’t want to get to a place in life where you’re sitting there with so much regret of all the things that you didn’t do, all the knowledge that you didn’t get, all the people that you didn’t support, or all the people you didn’t bring into your life. All these things that people get to the end of their life and they’re saying, “I wish I would have done that.” That’s the biggest tragedy in life. Getting to that deathbed, sitting there looking back with regret.

The biggest tragedy in life is getting to that deathbed and sitting there looking back with regret. Share on X

We could go on and on chatting, but it’s the end of our time together. You have seven tenets and four pillars that make up The Outlier Mindset. What didn’t I ask you yet that you think is something important to share?

You and I could talk for another five hours, I’m sure, because you have such a similar way of thinking in terms of mindset and how important it is to how people are living life but people can go to my website, GoRodman.com. You can see the seven tenets on there. I put them out there. You don’t have to buy the book to get the seven tenets. I want people to have them. I want people to know what they should be doing day to day to make sure they get outside of that learning curve.

In terms of those pillars, the only other thing I’d say is you get your mind right, you get your money, and get yourself physically in a good place too. If you are not physically in a good place, the way you eat, the way that you take care of your body and such, it’s going to be impactful on your mindset. You need to have that piece of the puzzle in place too if you’re going to get outside of that curve and get into that life that you want to be living.

I agree. I think that the body and mind are connected and the strength in one helps with the strength in the other but even more specifically, when you feel physically fit and strong, that’s supporting a healthy mindset. I agree with that 100%. Before we go, I want to know. I don’t know why this came up for me, I don’t always ask it but I felt like I wanted to ask you. Is there one quote that you keep coming back to or that drives you?

There are a lot of quotes that I like. One of my favorites has always been, “Don’t tell people what you’re going to do. Show them your results instead.” Many people are out there barking that they’re this, or that they’re that. They’re these self-proclaimed whatever. The work starts here. It starts with you. Don’t do it because everybody else needs to see you do it. Do it because you want to do it because it’s meaningful to you.

None of the other stuff matters. At some point in time, we’re all going to be gone from this earth. Somebody else is going to be living in this house that I’m in. My car is probably going to be a scrap heap. My furniture is going to be in an antique store. None of this stuff matters. The only thing that’s going to matter is what you do on that journey. Care about who you are here and then show up in the world that way.

 

Thank you for sharing that. That’s a perfect close to our show. Tell us again about the website that they can go to.

GoRodman.com. You can find me there. Reach out to me. I love to communicate with people and talk to people about their journeys. By all means, go there. Feel free to reach out to me.

Thank you very much for being here.

Thanks, Penny.

Thank you all. Again, I think that this is a perfect place and time for you to take that reset moment. We’re in midyear. It’s a good time to see and check in. Are you living the life that has meaning to you? Are you living the relationships? Rodman talked about, tribe. Have you found your tribe? Are you connected to the people who make you feel good, who elevate you, who you learn from? It’s a great time to take that reset moment for your life, for the year, and see where you’re going and put your plan in place now. What better time to do it than right now? Thank you all for being here. My name is Penny Zenker and this is Take Back Time. We’ll see you in the next episode.

 

Important Links

• Rodman Schley – LinkedIn
• The Outlier Mindset
• The Reset Mindset
• The Outlier Mindset: A Guide to Living with Purpose and Evolving Exponentially
• Go Rodman

 

About Rodman Schley

Rodman Schley is a purpose-driven outlier in entrepreneurship, real estate and media. Renowned as a serial entrepreneur, Rodman is a real estate expert, an acclaimed television producer and host, a published author, an executive consultant, an entrepreneur coach and a captivating keynote speaker. His unconventional approach to entrepreneurship, business, real estate investment and leadership has garnered acclaim from entrepreneurs, investors and business leaders worldwide.

Rodman’s keynote, “The Outlier Mindset: Living with Purpose and Evolving Exponentially,” stems from his personal journey of empowering individuals to craft lives aligned with their passions and purpose, leading to greater personal and professional fulfillment and building a life by design. Through his talks, he guides entrepreneurs, executives, investors, and employees to reshape their thinking and strategies, harnessing their unique strengths for success.

With three published books, “Finding Your Fortune in Repossessed Real Estate,” “Vacation Property Secrets” and “The Outlier Mindset,” Rodman shares his wealth of knowledge with audiences eager to unlock their full potential.

Having founded, sold or launched over 25 businesses, Rodman’s entrepreneurial spirit knows no bounds. From owning a television production company to spearheading a national poker tour, his companies span diverse industries.

Currently serving as CEO of Blue Fusion Capital, Rodman focuses on short-term vacation rental properties. Additionally, he is the CEO of EvolveX Studios, and he hosts “The Outlier Mindset Podcast,” which focuses on personal development and exponential growth.

Rodman’s expertise extends to the real estate investment and valuation realm. As founder and CEO of Commercial Valuation Consultants, he has been responsible for the valuation of over $20 billion in residential and commercial real estate. His visionary leadership earned him recognition on the Appraisal Institute National Board of Directors, culminating in his appointment as the National Vice President in 2019 and National President in 2021.

Rodman’s impact transcends business. As the creative force behind PBS’s nationally televised show “Urban Conversion,” alongside his wife Gina, he has championed the sustainability movement, earning over 30 Telly awards for social responsibility and education. The show was also nominated for an Emmy. The show’s acclaim reached new heights with an invitation to film at the White House from First Lady Michelle Obama in its inaugural season.

Beyond television, Rodman has overseen poker programming and comedy specials, including “Delete,” featuring Last Comic Standing winner and America’s Got Talent finalist Josh Blue.

Rodman lives in Arvada, outside of Denver, Colorado with his wife Gina and their two daughters.

 

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