Corporate culture can make or break any organization’s path towards success. Now more than ever, it is becoming a serious topic of conversation that transcends industry boundaries, and employers and leadership teams are increasingly paying attention to its importance. Joining Penny Zenker is Flipp’s Chief People Officer, Sandy Scholes, who explains how good leaders motivate their people and how companies can build great internal culture. Sandy talks about how she has helped sculpt company culture that has reaped benefits for employees and company alike, increasing productivity and employee satisfaction.  Learn how to drive innovative ways to improve company culture as you tune in to this insightful conversation. 

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Listen to the podcast here:

Leadership And Corporate Culture: How To Build Great Internal Culture With Sandy Scholes

On this show, we are looking to help you to work smarter, play smarter and live smarter. That’s what it’s all about. I’m excited to talk about it from an organizational perspective. Sandy Scholes is on with us and she is a Chief People and Culture Officer at Flipp. She’s there to develop and execute people strategies. She is passionate about it. I’m excited for you to read about her passion for growth, change management, organizational performance, training and development, and all that goes into that Chief People Officer role. Welcome, Sandy. It’s great to have you here. 

Thank you so much, Penny. It’s great to be here. 

What makes you so passionate about people and culture? 

There are lots. I have had the wonderful opportunity to start my career off with telecom in a different industry. I started in international HR. As I have gone through my career path and on my journey, I have worked in about five different industries, from private companies to public companies, from small to multinationals. What’s at the heart of creating an incredible organization is all about setting an amazing culture, treating people right and having strong leadership. I have had the opportunity to see greatness and not so great. You can see why and that makes me so passionate because it’s exciting to try to influence it and make an organization great. 

What is not happening that they are not seeing their people as their greatest asset? 

If we could figure that out, we could go and make a lot of money across many organizations. It’s the executive and the leadership. It’s at the top. You have to have an amazing CEO that truly gets it but people are what makes an organization successful. If you have that commitment, focus at the top and the rest of the executive team believe it, you will see that go all the way through the organization. It’s very clear and it permeates through the whole culture in what you do every day. When you don’t, it’s clear. People are smart. Employees in an organization know if an organization cares about what you do or not. 

Energy is palpable. I always talk about energy management. It doesn’t just apply to how we as individuals show up for our time, although it does. When you know that person that walks into the room and sucks the energy right out, sometimes you could walk in a building and you know from the culture that it’s toxic. 

When you are in an interview and talking to somebody, you can tell if they love what they are doing. It comes across, they are proud of everything they do, the programs and the people they work with. I’m total with you. You can feel it. 

At the end of the day, the show is about productivity. I believe that that is the ultimate. If you don’t have an organization that is working well together, then it doesn’t matter if one individual is productive. You are not as a whole, going to be productive. You have been across all these different industries. You said you have seen good, the bad and the ugly. What do you think differentiates that leader that creates that positive culture that people want to work for the organization and ones that don’t? What are 1 or 2 of the factors that you have seen? 

Part of it is what you are talking about around productivity. If you look at productivity, it can only happen if you step back and say, “What are you asking me to do?” What goals? What are you clear about doing? An amazing leader will inspire people and talk about, “What’s your vision? Where we are trying to go as an organization? How I can help grow and develop you so that you can be the best and contribute towards what we are trying to accomplish as a company?” It’s bringing meaning and purpose to your job. It’s supporting individuals in their growth and development to help them make sure that they’ve got the tools or resources. It’s the kind of support they need to get their job done. That I think is the most critical thing you can do. 

Let’s focus on meaning and purpose because that’s huge for all of us to motivate ourselves. We can be inspired but the motivation comes intrinsically and when we can connect to that meaning, how does a leader help me? How do you at Flipp help to inspire that motivation and others? How do you help them to see that greater meaning and own it? Instead of a transaction, it would be an ownership. 

First, it comes back to making sure you are clear about what your culture is as an organization. At Flipp, we have a very strong sense of values and we called them the three H’s. We have this other–centeredness, but Humble, Hungry and Highly intelligent. We make sure that when we go into an interview process, 60% of what we decide on is around fit. It’s all about fitness and making sure that someone is other–centered and they live those values. Bringing someone into the organization that truly has that kind of integrity, we know they are going to fit and are going to be able to work well with their peers. As it goes on, you need to sit down and make sure that you understand what someone is passionate about. 

I talked to my organization about this all the time. I truly believe that we should be identifying what people are passionate about. If you can have your employees, team members do what they love and what they are passionate about, you are going to get the performance, alignment and they are going to feel a sense of connection and purpose. They are going to do an amazing job. I don’t know anyone who has ever done something they love and don’t do it very well. You end up seeing lots of great success. 

That’s where that internal motivation comes. They are already passionate about it. It’s like, “You are going to pay me to do what I’m passionate about? I love that.” I’m repeating a couple of these points for the readers to take this and understand it. First of all, you are very clear and very descriptive. I like the three H’s. It’s Humble, Hungry, and Highly intelligent. They are descriptive values and not the generic type of values. You interview for them. Do you have specific questions that help you to understand whether somebody is a fit? 

We have a scorecard process and three different stages of the interview process. Everyone, regardless of being a hiring manager, peers, client groups, is looking for those three H’s and other–centeredness. We provide questions and make sure that we get very specific behavioral examples to justify or to validate that the person does truly, intrinsic and live those. 

It’s the behavior. The words are descriptive of the behaviors that you want to see. I have seen a lot of people who say, “We have defined our values,” but they haven’t defined the behaviors that go with those values. I would like you to talk a little bit about that and how that creates greater ownership for each employee. 

We have had a hard time with the Humble when you talk about behavior. When you talk about humble, some people believe it means stepping back and as an other–centered individual, not taking credibility, not being credible in something or not showcasing themselves. Sometimes when someone goes to an interview process, you are going into the interview and prepping. You want to be able to sell yourself and make sure that you get these examples because everyone teaches you that. “I’ve got to show them that I can do these things.” We have had the conversation many times where some people will say, “No, they seem like they are too confident. I don’t know what they fit in. They don’t seem humble.” To your point, there are lots of different behaviors that we have to make sure that people are aware of. We do training. We have videos around all of our culture and these values about what they are and what they are not to make sure that we are clear around what those behaviors would look like. 

Let’s take Humble as an example because you made a good point there. You can define a word but everybody doesn’t understand the same thing about that word. Humble can mean different things to different people. I like that you were saying, “Here’s the behavior, here’s what it is and what it’s not.” Can you give us one example that might be in your training that doesn’t give away the show? That it says, “Here is a humble behavior that we expect in the organization and here is what it’s not.” 

We have this little card. It talks about our different values and all of our principles and how we define humble as being confident but knowing that there’s always room for improvement. Some of the examples that we talk about are examples and we will bring them around our own workgroups that we are doing. “How can we be very comfortable and confident when we roll out a program, make product updates? From a people perspective, if we rolled out a program which we are working on, performance and development, what went well? What should we be proud of and make sure we share? What do we learn from this?” Those are all the things around learning and growth. “Where are areas of improvement? What can we always do better? These worked well. These are areas that we are going to build on and improve upon going forward.” We look at it in that context. 

Corporate Culture: When you’re interviewing somebody, you can tell if they love what they’re doing. It comes across.

What is it not? 

It’s not keeping quiet and not being proud of some of these great things that we are doing. It doesn’t mean that you can’t celebrate as a team and acknowledge all the great things that are going on. 

A lot of people may feel like, “I have defined my values. That’s good enough. I’ve got this.” I want them to see that there is a deeper level. I love that you’ve got it on the card, you’ve got the videos and you are living it. It’s not just a word that’s on the wall. You are living it in everything that you do. 

It is important because I have seen too many organizations where you do put on the wall and don’t live it. The wonderful thing is during COVID, you can appreciate the fact it has been difficult to try to make sure that people feel connected, you still feel part of this strong culture and you don’t lose that. What keeps me up at night? We are going to go remote and probably going to stay in this world of remote in the future or at least a hybrid. The future of work is going to look very different. How do you maintain such an incredible culture and values that are important so that it doesn’t change too much? 

We have a culture team. It has about fifteen individuals from across our organization. They have been incredible at being ambassadors of what we should look at. We rolled out a virtual award ceremony based on our values in November 2020. It was unbelievable to see the kind of nomination. It was a peer–driven nomination process where people could acknowledge all the great work and how people live the values in the company. We did that to reinforce the importance of it and start to celebrate and make it top of mind because there are people who are complete ambassadors and make it an amazing place to work. They go above and beyond. We rolled this program out in November 2020 and it was fantastic. We are going to do this as an annual thing that we are going to organize every year. I don’t think it would have happened if we weren’t in COVID. 

The benefit for many organizations, even though it’s painful to go through, is it’s hard for us to get and think outside the box. With COVID, it pushed us right outside the box. It was either get creative, sinks or swim. Either you get creative and pivot or you go down with the ship. Many organizations did come up with some great creative ways to engage their people and change their business model so that it’s going to work more effectively. What else did you do during COVID that might be a tip for other people who are reading and they see 2022 working from home and working in this way? What are some of the things? 

Ninety percent of our organization are Millennials or Gen Z. Some of the challenges you can appreciate, we have all these moms and dads with young children, they are getting going on with COVID and all the schools canceling. We have had a lot of people on the screen where you see the kids coming up. They were bugging their mum, dad and there are a lot of stress. We were getting a lot of stress across the organization. You can appreciate the fact, “How you get your job done? How you get all the demands of your job while you have your job at home now with your kids, taking care of them and making sure that they feel great or whatever other things that are pulling and grabbing your time?” 

We have done a lot of things. One, we wanted to make sure that we provided a little bit less stress and changed the way that we work. We said to all of our team members, “Forget the regular hours of work. Your 8:30 to 4:30, 9:00 to 5:00, 9:00 to 6:00 or whatever it might be that can go out the window, your family comes first.” We have sent very strong messages to all of our coaches and leaders in the organization around flexibility. “If you see people and they need to get off the screen, they have to take care of breakfast for their kids or they have to go take care of lunch, that’s okay. That’s the first priority.” We have complete flexibility. 

We wanted to do something where, “How do you alleviate the stress of households?” We used to say, “Bring your whole self to work.” Now, “Work is in your home.” We provided a laundry service for our parents with kids on a monthly basis to have this laundry service which is a huge help. I have three teenage boys and that makes a big difference. It’s 3 pounds of laundry on a monthly basis that I don’t have to do and I don’t have to iron. I love it. 

We are trying to do different things to also engage people. We are trying to capture best practices. People have been extremely creative across the organization, ranging from morning check-ins with their groups, words for the week, to having cooking classes where they follow cooking and someone will be on the screen, to candle making, to they will read books and instead of training and development, going to courses, someone will read a book and now people are trying to share the learning across the organization. People are being extremely creative. It’s amazing to see the level of teamwork that is being displayed. 

Those are great ideas. What that tells me and this is also the sign of a great organization, is the organization is taking responsibility for how do we help reduce the stress and create more flexibility. Laundry service is being a great example. We can reduce the stress. We can take some of that, giving more flexible hours. What can we do to do our part so that people will do the best they can to do their part? A lot of organizations don’t do enough. They do some and feel like, “That’s good enough. It’s up to the employee to manage it.” You have people who say, “I don’t have kids. It’s not fair that you give them flexibility.” I have seen a lot of that on LinkedIn going back and forth of bad–mouthing an organization that’s trying to do something. It’s good that you are taking that. Do you have people who say, “That’s not fair to us because it’s more of a benefit to them?” 

I was expecting a little bit more. We had a couple of people asking the question, “Why not for the whole organization?” When we stepped back and said, “You can see the stress on the screen.” It’s not one size fits all. Everybody is unique and has unique situations. Once we had a conversation, we tabled it. It was good. They are equivalent to town halls, we call them big scrums and we have monthly updates. Everyone gets on the screen and can ask questions. Those are some of the questions and I’m happy people brought them up. Once we talked about it, it was completely understood. What we did do too, though, is we also, at the same time said, “We have given dinner vouchers out to the whole organization to alleviate and make it a little bit special, so people can have dinner, cook for them or deliver to them, so they don’t have to do it themselves.” We were trying to think of all the different groups and different things that we can do. 

That’s what is the biggest pain. It’s, “I never realized to cook many different meals.” I used to be home by myself. I have worked from home for a long time and now everybody is here. I didn’t use that many dishes. It seems like every single dish in the house is used every single meal. It’s ridiculous. We run the dishwasher twice a day. The amount of work definitely at home has increased. 

I can completely relate. I said to the guys, “We have to put a new schedule together because this is not working. I am sick of unloading and loading the dishwasher every day. I’m going to put a list together of who’s vacuuming, doing the dishes.” We are going to put a new schedule in place for the reason you are talking about.   

I have a teenage boy as well. I never knew how much this kid ate. He’s at school. I don’t realize what he gets at lunch. I was like, “This is something serious.” We then have the food police, “Don’t eat that. That’s mine.” There are all these new dynamics that you have to deal with. Seriously, I want to go back to the point of the flexibility of hours. How did that work? Let’s say you have client meetings. What if there’s not the ability? I hear a lot of organizations saying, “We can’t offer that level of flexibility because we need to have people attending meetings and things like that at certain times.” 

We have not found it difficult to be able to accommodate people. People will jump in. Our sales organization and business development team are the ones that call in all the clients. The clients themselves are fantastic. They were going through the same challenges. The minute you say to a client, “Sandy can’t make the meeting right now. We are going to go ahead. We might have to send the information afterward.” People get it. It’s being fully transparent. I believe that by showing support for your people, everyone on the other side respect that and they like it better. They respect you for making that decision. We haven’t had any issues with that. 

We have a set of rules. This is a perfect environment for us to kill those stupid rules because they are stupid rules. Who set them up? Sometimes clients want to meet outside of hours because everybody’s going through this. Instead of assuming what the client wants or, “This is the way it always was. This is how we should do it.” Why not ask the question? Why not open it up and see how it works? It is a perfect opportunity outside the box to kill some of those stupid rules. Did you guys kill any stupid rules that you had? 

We are starting to. Meetings, for instance, we are starting to kill the number of meetings that you have to be at and who should be at all those meetings. If I’m not going to make a decision at a meeting, I can completely empower someone on my team. They can go make that decision. I don’t need to be there. It’s not like everyone has to be in these meetings. 

“Let’s free up some time for people.” Our sales organization was so used to traveling all the time with customer sites. Our customers are saying, “You don’t need to travel anymore.” People are able to stay home with their families. We have people who saw their family 50% of the time because they were traveling. Now, they are home all the time. It’s amazing. Their quality of life has improved. We have to challenge some of these things. 

The other area is around mental health. It was always taboo. We shouldn’t say anything about health. We are all very open now. If I have an appointment and I need to take my son to an appointment, doctor’s appointment or there are some challenges that I or my family is going through, we are very open about it. You don’t have to feel like you are pressured to share whatever you are uncomfortable with, even though you are horrible at sharing it. 

You don’t have to go into the nitty–gritty detail. You can stay at a high level, having a challenge, need a little space. 

People are great. Customers are great with that. Even if we can be real and say, “We care about our people.” The one thing COVID has done was brought this humanity back where we are able to be a little bit vulnerable, more real and care for one another. I hope that doesn’t go away because that’s the one thing that I like. 

Corporate Culture: If you had conversations along the way, there would be no difficult conversations because everyone would know how they are doing.

That’s your fourth H, the Humanity. In some ways, they say we are disconnected but I think in some ways if done right, it has deepened our connections and our ability to connect. It’s a question of whether we take advantage of that and that’s then up to the organization and the individual. 

I hope we don’t lose that. We are going to do everything we can to keep that. 

I’m working on a new book. I wanted to ask you, it’s around the culture to an extent. I’m talking about ownership. A lot of people, there are a lot of focus and I hear a lot of organizations that have problems with accountability. That’s the wrong view that their problem is with personal ownership. We are focused on accountability which tends to be at the end of the process where we slap somebody in the hand and it’s all about consequences. What would you say to that? What do you think is the difference? How do we hold people accountable and have them have ownership? What’s the difference there for you? 

I touched on it when I talked about goals. I’m a big proponent of setting goals. I went to a course years ago when I worked for an organization, BD. I remember we had a leadership development course. A big a-ha went off when we were talking about this story and this book. It was about this gentleman who found that people weren’t performing well. He was trying to figure out why aren’t they. They were stressed, nervous and didn’t want to fail. In essence, what he did is he made sure at the beginning of the year, he said to all these people, “Regardless of what you do, you are going to be an A student. That’s your mark. At the end of the year, you have nothing to worry about.” All these kids performed exceptionally well. 

It comes back to and I have always kept that with me to say, it’s around accountability, “How do you help people have that ownership?” It’s about having a conversation at the beginning of every fiscal year. It’s about understanding what the organization is trying to do, how you can contribute and what your goals are. To the point where I try to drive home with my team and when we were coaching leaders, it’s not just when you put a goal together and we talk about smart goals. I’m sure people have gone through training and talked about it. It’s more than that. You need to understand it. You have to own the fact that, “If I’ve got these goals and you are my leader, what does A–plus look like at the end of the year then?” 

If you want me to deliver this program at the end of the year, it shouldn’t be a question, How I performed?” We should be very clear about how I did because, at the beginning of the year, we had concrete clarity as to what an A or B would look like. If you spend the time upfront, which is a pain in the butt sometimes because it takes a lot of time and effort and you go back and forth a couple of times but if you get that clarity, accountability, the person owns it. As a leader, you have ongoing conversations. At Flipp, we have monthly coaching conversations around our goals and quarterly conversations around our growth and development goals. If you are these conversations ongoing, the person owns what they are doing and at the end year, there are no surprises. 

It’s managing the expectation. I had the same experience wherein, everybody was getting great reviews but the organization wasn’t performing. We were like, “That’s not possible.” The CEO said, “This is wrong.” You can’t get great reviews and the organization not be doing well. Revamp the whole thing and did exactly that. It did take a long time and defining, “Here’s what A looks like. This is over and above.” We define each of those levels so that there was no question at the end as to we were in line. It was clear and the organization would be performing if everybody got meets or above. 

The biggest complaint I have heard with people is at the end your manager saying, “This is demotivating. I am uncomfortable. I have to deliver a performance rating to these people and it demotivates them. I can’t tell everyone that they were amazing, whatever your score or your ratings are.” I always go back to say, “Not everyone did perform at B or A-plus. ” There is differentiation. If you had the conversations along the way, there would be no difficult conversations because everyone would know how they were doing. 

You would be checking in along the way. Some companies are going away from these year-end reviews for exactly that reason because that’s one of those stupid rules that will review you once a year and not regularly. How do you see that at Flipp? 

I would not support setting goals at the beginning of the year. You are not having conversations at the end of the year and giving a rating to an individual. This is not fair. We were adults. It’s about the conversation and, “How I support my team and give them the tools because I want everyone to hit it out of the park. I want them to all do fantastic.” It’s around the conversations and reducing the barriers. Along the way, you will find out, “Why aren’t you able to deliver? What’s getting in your way?” Sometimes things will get in the way and the market changes. To your point, the organization is starting to pivot or something is happening, then you have to back up and say, “Where are we going to reprioritize and what can we do differently?” You have to have those conversations to make sure that you are guiding them. 

That is the leader’s role. You are going to save a lot of time by investing a little bit more time in communication and conversation about those timely reviews than what it takes to pack it all into a year. It reminds me of my kids who are going through AP tests. It’s like cramming for a test. It’s doing the whole year at once versus taking those little incremental tests and making sure that you are developing the skills or reaching the goals along the way. Let’s circle back around to that passion and finding people’s passion and tapping into the passion. If one part of ownership is managing that expectation and setting the goals together, the other part is that motivation and tapping into their passion. How do leaders do that? How do they tap into an individual’s passion? 

You have to have the conversation right upfront. It comes back down to what I call job sculpting. I believe every leader has an opportunity to have a conversation with their team members to find out in your job, “Here are what the challenges are. This is where we are going to focus. These are the areas we need to work on. This is what you are going to deliver. At the same time, what do you love? What is it about your job you love? What don’t you love to do? If you are telling me that you love communication and influencing, then what can I do? What development projects can I do? What do I think about what’s going on in the organization? How can I get you involved in other areas that encompass that communication and influence? How do you draw on that?” 

It comes back to a conversation. What we have done is in 2020, we created in our performance and growth program. At the beginning of 2021, every leader sits down, talks about and asks questions with their team members. “What do you love to do? What are you passionate about? What do you want to do from a career aspiration perspective?” We pull those things together and create our own goals. Sometimes we will sculpt things. What does that mean? “If your role does not encompass a lot of the stuff that you are passionate about, how can we bring that into your role? How do we carve it out and change it a little bit?” We are on this journey now of what I call job sculpting and trying to create this across the organization and help leaders have the skills and capabilities to be able to have those kinds of conversations.  

Can you share an example of where you have been able to creatively do that? In my head, I think about somebody passionate about animals, gardening and maybe art. How does that fit into the organization? I would love to know an example so that leaders out there can connect the dots. Sometimes it sounds good in theory but how do I do that? 

I will give you an example. I’m sure that the individual on my team will not be upset if I share this. She was just a complete advocate and champion for development, coaching and life coaching. There’s an individual that is on our team. She is providing support in the area of engagement when we launched engagement surveys and doing a lot of other things in the organization on training and development support programs. She talked to us and said she wanted to go get her own life coaching certification which she did. She’s extremely passionate about helping people, around their careers, think about their careers and what they are doing. 

Another project that we are rolling out is career pathing and what your career journey is. We moved her from her current role into this career journey. She’s helping us work with a third–party vendor launching all of our career pathing. As part of that, we’ve carved out a program that once we go live on this program, she’s going to provide life coaching to employees, coach them and their managers to support them on their career pathing. We’ve been able to take what she’s passionate about, what she’s loving and create a role for her which is beneficial for us because she is going to be amazing. It’s great for her and her development. 

I get what you mean by job sculpting, as it may create a new position in the organization. Does that mean now you have to replace her old position? You have created a new position. Maybe some leaders are thinking, “That’s going to create extra costs. We can’t go around creating a new position for every employee.” 

We have not added another headcount. What we did with her old role is we knew there was another individual and part of our team who wanted to get into the engagement side, so we divvied up her role, took different chunks and gave it to other individuals. Don’t think for a second that we added all this volume onto these other people. We didn’t. We made some choices and said, “What are we going to stop doing? What isn’t that important and necessary?” That’s what we have done. It has been amazing. 

I have another example in a past job where I had someone who was on my recruitment team. I also had someone who was doing compensation. It was interesting when we went through this exercise and I asked them what they love to do. The person who was recruiting loved compensation, analytical capabilities, who wanted to go into analytics. The person I had on comp loved the whole, “How do I influence people? I want to build relationships.” I switched their roles and they were incredible after that. 

What I’m hearing is that, “One of the stupid rules that you guys don’t follow that other companies might follow is that they were a slave to their org chart.” You have a very dynamic org chart where you might say, “This job was gone,” and I love that. Thank you so much for sharing and having such a great conversation here. I ask every guest what their definition of productivity and why. I will close out this session with that. 

Productivity to me is being able to get the stuff done that you have on your list that you want to deliver against in a way where you don’t have excess stress. It’s knowing exactly what you need to deliver and how you are going to deliver it. I haven’t always been overly productive. I have had some challenges. There are few tips I have learned along the way to help me become more productive. The top two that I would suggest people think about, one is stepping back. I don’t know about other people but we have a heavy meeting culture. That’s one thing that I see that is challenging. I find sometimes you are in so many meetings and you were just, “How the hell do you get all your work done?” You don’t want to have to work 24/7 because we all have a life and we’ve got other commitments that we are going to do. 

Every Friday, I step back. I look at my calendar for the following week and identify what meetings I don’t need to go to. Who can I send on my behalf and empower? I mean, truly empower like if I’m not at that meeting, they are empowered to make the decision. I have to live with it because they are attending on my behalf. I disinvite myself from as many meetings as I possibly can. That’s important. The other one is probably like other people, I write things and tasks in my calendar. I try to identify if I have to deliver a presentation to the board. I will back it up a week and make sure that I have practiced. I’ve got everything done. I do put steps and backtrack to make sure that I manage myself almost like projects. 

Break it down into a project, little milestones, put it in the calendar and then you know it’s going to get done. Thank you so much for being here. Where can people find out more about you and about Flipp? 

Corporate Culture: Every leader has an opportunity to have a conversation with their team members to find out what challenges they are facing and what they should be focusing on.

You can find out more on LinkedIn. It’s @SandyScholes. With Flipp, they can Google Flipp and you will get all the information you need to know. You can find our app. It’s a free app where you can have savings and deals. I would encourage people to make sure that they get onto our app. 

Another way to be more productive, save money. For everybody wants to save money, so go check Flipp out and knowing that it comes from such a great company that’s being run in such a great way by great people is also encouraging for everybody to go out and get it. Thank you for being here. We covered a lot of good stuff. For leaders, take some further notes because there were a lot of great tips that came out of this show. We will see you in the next episode. 

Important Links:

• Flipp 
• @SandyScholes – LinkedIn 
• App – Flipp app 
• https://Corp.Flipp.com/about-us 

About Sandy Scholes